My young adult has left the Church (part 5)

This is a little series of posts I put out in 2010, at the time they were helpful for a number of people, I hope that continues to be true today.

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Continuing to look at how to engage with the "deChurched" we look to the issue of theodicy. This post is not an exhaustive conversation on the question of why is there evil in the world if there is a God (aka - the question of theodicy ), rather it is to help ignite conversations between those in the Church and those who have left the Church. This is a rather lofty topic and I anticipate you have thoughts of your own as well, consider this an invitation to share those thoughts.

Before I go any further it should be noted that I do not know a single person who can explain this mystery. I know there are people who have thoughts on the topic, but I have yet to discover if there is any sort of consensus on this issue. If you are reading this and looking for the answer to the question of theodicy, I am afraid I will not meet your expectations.

In that same vein, this is also not a post about what I believe about theodicy questions. Rather, this is a post to offer tools which have helped me begin conversations with people of all kinds and tools which I hope might be helpful in your conversations with people you encounter.

Generally speaking, when theoldicy issues come up in a conversation I have with a "deChurched", agnostic, or atheist the other person has a very logical and methodical argument. These arguments are generally very tight and the person seems sold on the logic they present. So, as one about to engage in conversations it is worth noting that people think very deeply about this issue. I recently got an email that was three pages long on written by a "deChurched" person on this topic and that instantly said to me, "this is a passionate issue to this person."

When I have engaged conversations on theodicy with the "deChurched" I have found great bridge building when I ask a lot of questions. Not questions to trap or questions intended to lead down a path that you think leads to a certain "logical conclusion". No, questions of authentic curiosity are the type of questions I am talking about.

"Why do you think there is violence in the world?"

"Do you think humanity, at our core, is inherently good or evil?"

"What sort of ethics do you follow?"

"Where or how did you come to learn this?"

Questions like these are not perfect but they do not need to be. The intent is to open conversation and get at the heart of the matter (which I believe is what each of our God images are).

As you engage in conversation I promise you will be challenged and encounter questions that may cut to the core of your own theology and God image. That is a good and wonderful thing. Allow the conversation to open you up and share what you believe and where/how you come to believe this.

As for me personally, I have found great success in reading a lot of Rene Girard, anthropology books, Walter Wink, behavioral economics, and evolutionary psychology. These sources give me many more areas to pull into the conversation from additional questions and metaphors to science experiments and illustrations. I would invite you to find resources that address the issues of theodicy and weave them into your own thought/question asking. There is only so far in the area of theodicy that one can go on their own without help and I hope we Christians would continue to seek help from God and our neighbors.

I know this is rather vague, but it is important that we do not have all the answers especially in areas of such a great mystery. If you do have the answers and you are trying to 'convince' others of your answers, I am curious to know how that is going? If you are not having any 'success' I wonder what would happen if we stopped trying to convince people with our words and invite them into a relationship with our actions.

My young adult has left the Church (part 4)

This is a little series of posts I put out in 2010, at the time they were helpful for a number of people, I hope that continues to be true today.

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Of the three issues which keep coming up in conversation with those who might be considered "deChurched" the first one I wanted to address is the most fundamental, but perhaps the least controversial of the three (especially as I listen to Christians talk about these three issues).

Again, the list to consider is:

1) God image (who or what is God like).

2) Issues of theodicy (why there is evil in the world).

3) Pluralism issues (is any religion the only way to a relationship with God).

It can be argued that our God image shapes the way we each see and interact with the world. For those who view God as one who sets boundaries and enforces edicts, those same people might view the world as a place that boundaries need to be set and edicts need to be enforced. For those who view God as boundary breaking and inclusive to all, those same people might view the world as a place that boundaries need to be shattered and inclusion is to be highly valued and sought after. These are general statements but I would be willing to bet that the way you see the world to the way you interact with neighbors to the way you view the role of governments even to the way you respond in a crisis are all impacted and connected to the way you see God.

Our world is shaped by the way we see God (and by the way, when I say God I understand that it is difficult for me to talk about God outside my own God images). When a person who take the agnostic or atheist position, at least in my experience, generally has a God image that many people who affirm the reality of God also have. When I encounter someone who is a vowed atheist or agnostic I generally ask them about how they view God. Sometimes I put the question in the negative, "Tell me about the God you do not believe in." Getting people (all people) to talk about their God image is not only a great starting point to engage conversation but, and perhaps more importantly, hearing God images is the source of much bridge building between people.

For instance, I recently had a conversation with a person who was agnostic. She had a wonderful story to tell and I was captivated by it. In the course of the conversation she said, "I just do not think the God is looking down on us all keeping track of our wrongs. I just think God is more like the love that connects me to others."

To her surprise (I think) I said, "I agree with you. In fact that view of God is often called 'panentheism' and is upheld by many Christian teachings and doctrines. It is how I often view God."

She sat there for a moment and said, "I thought Christians had to believe that God was 'up there' (pointing upward to the sky) and you have to believe that in order to avoid 'down there' (pointing down to the floor)."

By affirming her God image and rooting her image in a tradition of thought that was beyond her knowledge - panentheism - made her feel less "out there" with her thoughts and in many ways 'normalized' her feelings and gave a sense of confidence. She and I walked away with a bridge that we both could walk on, albeit she is still a vowed agnostic at this point.

Bottom line, by talking about and addressing our own God images we can build bridges between those who are "other" because more often than not - we all have overlapping God images in some way.

My young adult has left the Church (reengaging the conversation)

This is a little series of posts I put out in 2010, at the time they were helpful for a number of people, I hope that continues to be true today.

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Over the course of this conversation I have heard from many people who were in the Church and then through a number of things (unresolved questions, irrational logic, inability to reconcile ideas, frustration with "church folk" or religion, etc.) which have become too much for many people and they have left the Church. Many people are labeling this group the "deChurched" (which by the way we all know labels have a number of limitations which are not going to be considered at this time but they are noted in the back of my mind).

The "deChurched" group is really the group which I feel called to focus much energy toward. Not to "reclaim" them as "lost souls", but to seek a relationship with this group of people and learn what it is about the Christian faith they have rejected. As I listen to some of the "deChurched" I hear three things that seem to keep coming up that seem to be the stickiest of the sticky points.

1) God image (who or what is God like).

2) Issues of theodicy (why there is evil in the world).

3) Pluralism issues (is any religion the only way to a relationship with God).

I know there are many issues and there are many others who have taken these issues on in more in depth ways I wanted to focus the conversation here on this blog to these three issues which keep coming up in many of the conversations I have with people from the "Unchurched" to the "Churched" to the "deChurched".

SIDE NOTE - If you are interested, Brian Mclaren's book "A New Kind of Christianity" takes on 10 questions where I have only selected 3. It was a wonderful read and one which forces the Christian reader to de-construct our faith in order to find our roots. I recommend it for all Christians and any non-Christians who may be interested in learning more about a Christian faith which may take more seriously the questions than other expressions of Christian faith.

So, without getting to far into it, the next three posts are going to look at these above topics in a very surface way in order to engage a conversation with any community of readers that stumble upon this blog.